Seems the militants who posted these photo's of CBC Reporter Terry Milewski are still upset that I exposed their facebook site last year. So now I have a group of Zombies trolling my site, Zombies who evidently think it's perfectly normal to post death threats. Here's the original post.
Ah the joys of Multiculturalism can't you just feel the Love? Seems members of this Facebook Sikh Community (note you will need a Facebook login), are incensed at the CBC & Terry Milewski for a piece he did on Sikh Extremism. And just to share the love I'll post the lovely pictures our friends the extremists made. Enjoy.
Update: For those of you without a facebook login here's a screen shot of the Sikh Hate Site that featured these vile photo's. Note the the police took the threats seriously enough to investigate. I quote from the site:
********* UPDATE NOVEMBER 1************
The pictures have FINALLY been taken down. Rejoice!
"Also, apparently the police in British Columbia don't have enough crime going on over there or they have nothing better to do than investigate a bunch of kids on the internet that are harmlessly expressing their free speech SO THIS IS A NOTE TO EVERYONE TO BE VERY VERY CAREFUL ABOUT WHAT YOU WRITE!!! THE THOUGHT POLICE... sorry, i mean the various canadian police forces WILL TRACK YOUR EVERY MOVE AND COME TO YOUR HOUSE TO INTERROGATE YOU... thats right folks, canada has become a third world country where YOUR "FREE SPEECH" has a price... that is, of course, if you're a minority.. WHITE PEOPLE FEEL FREE TO WRITE WHAT YOU WANT, YOU GUYS ARE PROTECTED BY CHARTERS AND WHATNOT..."
51 comments:
I'm Sikh, but I'm hardly militant.
I just don't like your site.
And we're probably the main bulk of your readers, we have been reading the entire time you know.
Stop it guys, just stop coming to the site.
Done.
Demonstrated discipline is the best part of all. No more.
Aww please don't go. My regular readers will miss your silly antics.
We're not going anywhere, don't worry.
We copy all your posts and distribute them on a list serve, and have been for some time.
We'll just stop coming by here.
Aww poor wittle baby, cry.
Let's see who cries, even years from now. Let's see.
Something tells me you are already a miserable, lonely, fat old woman who feels as if she has no purpose in life.
Cry. I know that hurt. Now cry some more.
Oh brother;)
Really guys, leave them alone.
There are other plans in store.
Oh I can hardly wait, don't tell me I know more illiterate comments hoo haw!
Nah, we're smarter than that.
Funny how you make this a condemnation of multiculturalism in Canada.
Racism is a global problem.
Multi-cult is the problem sonny.
Seems like you\'re the problem.
People would get along fine without hate mongerers like you.
You're the one who's upset about having the death threat and these vile pictures exposed, and your calling me a hate mongerer? God you are thick.
Why is she deleting comments?
hahahah. she's deleting comments.
Some people never learn. Sigh.
Wait, you think THIS is revenge?
ROFL.
Nah I think it's a bunch of wankers - like you.
I guess we will see who gets the last wank though, right?
There is this recurring human trait of becoming what you say you are not by dint of resentful contest of the other's attribution of violent resentment.
A religion that can't show you the way out of such paradoxical entanglements is a religion to move beyond...
Of course it's much easier to sit back and talk of revenge... but that's a path to Satanic religion.
Sikhism started as a pacifist cult. Contact with Islam changed that. In any case, we understand a religion best in terms of its origins....
Go ahead, pretend you know anything about Sikhism.
And call it a Satanic religion while you are at it.
I don\'t see a single religion other than Christianity that isn\'t regularly bashed here.
I find it rather chilling that a group of so called Sikhs spend their time threatening a female blogger on the internet. I expect this kind of barbaric behavior from Political Islamists but not the Sikh community.
I had nothing negative to say about the Sikh community but reading the responses here chills me at the infered violence they have threatened Blaze with. You call yourselves MEN, I call you cowards. It's easy to threaten a female while you are hiding behind a computer screen bring that crap out into public and you'll get your cowardly asses whopped by your own community.
Hang your heads in shame, a group of small minded bullies and male cowards.
"so called Sikhs spend their time threatening a female blogger on the internet."
It certainly doesn't match my experience of that religion, either. And note the future threats: someday they'll get you. How many extremist idiots have vowed to destroy my country in the name of their particular blood soaked cause? I've lost count, they'll probably have to stand in line.
And next Canada Day, could we have a cage match to the death between some radical islamists and these guys? If our peaceful and democratic society is going to be destroyed, at least i should get some entertainment out of it.
For the last time people, the word is "hatemonger" NOT "hate mongerer" or "hatemongerer" and all the other words people invent to describe people they don't agree with. It's like "fishmonger" and "costermonger."
Personally, I don't associate Sikhs with terrorism, despite the Air India bombing and the assassination of Indira Gandhi. I was shocked out of my child's mind when I discovered that Sikhs LIVING IN CANADA were handing out candies to celebrate Gandhi's murder. I couldn't understand that at all; up until then I had never heard of Canadians celebrating the deaths of an enemy out in public like that.
This barbarous behaviour made me think very badly of Sikhs, but then we had a class presentation on Sikhism and I thought, well, okay, it couldn't have been ALL the Sikhs doing that. And in reading history, I saw what a great contribution Sikhs made to the British-led forces in the Second World War.
In short, Canadians-born-and-raised-in-Canada don't tend to think about minority groups all that much, or think of any of their minority group friends as "oh, my friend in a Minority Group." Live and let live. However, when we see behaviour in Canada so foreign it shocks the heck out of us, we start to notice the differences and wonder whether this threatens the way of life we and our ancestors have been building since 1867 or (if a long-time Maritimer or French-Canadian) even earlier.
So Sikhs in Canada? No problem. Why not? Given the history of the former British Empire, it's great that there are Sikhs in the RCMP and the Canadian Armed Forces. But hatreds that have nothing to do with Canada are better left behind in India. That goes for everybody, including the Irish.
(In the case of the Irish, read Ireland for "India", etc.)
Heh, learn to read. I didn't call Sikhism Satanic; I said those who are focussed on revenge are on a Satanic path. That's because the revenge artist makes himself the source of the transcendence he pretends to obey. Any human who plays God, instead of following God, becomes Satanic.
They don't seem to realize, that if members of a community commit the largest mass-murder in Canadian history, based on a religious conflict on the other side of the globe, then there may be some negative publicity of that community.
Only posts from one side of this flame war were threatening and it wasn't BCF's. My opinion has been changed forever about the other side and will view them with caution and mistrust from now on. Whateverphobias do not materialize in a vacuum. They are borne of observations and impressions one gets from exchanges like this one.
I'm not a Sikh but have several friends who are. What I've learned from them is that what has gone wrong with the younger male Sikh population, at least in Vancouver, is that as young boys & then as young men they were overly praised and never admonished. They were held up as virtual Princes in their communities, while the girls were treated like second class citizens.
Eventually this lead several of these young men to form gangs and then to carve out a large slice of the drug dealing business. These fellows have done a lot of harm to a lot of people throughout the larger Vancouver community.
Fast forward to the past couple of years. The older Sikh community knows that it has a severe cancer in its midst and some are trying to cure it from within. I applaud them.
Unfortunately we have several commenters on here and members of the Facebook group who have pulled the old Al Sharpton trick of screaming "racism" whenever anyone criticizes them. It's nothing other than a deep rooted form of denial for which they should seek psychological help and/or form a self-help group called STA = Sikh Thugs Anonymous.
Great post- poster's above me.
Seraphic Single, as God as my witness I'll never type Hate Monger as two words again. Opps I just did. Hatemonger, breathes out.
The Minister of Multiculture (gag me with a spoon) hit the nail on the head when he stated blocks of immigrants have to stop bringing their blood feuds and cultural hatred into Canada. I'm tired of waring fractions shedding blood on Canadian Streets over out dated barbaric cultural beliefs, old fueds or the caste system. This is Canada, be damn grateful we've been as tolerant as we have been. Take your hatred and the urge to shed blood in the name of your cause out of this country.
If the "Cause" is worthy of dying for might I suggest the Sikhs go to the Mother Land and die or deal drugs there?
Hi everyone,
Firstly, I think that when some of the young people posted comments, their use of words like "we'll see who suffers" is to be understood in the cultural context. Those comments are not threats of violence, nor an attempt to intimidate. Firstly, I feel the "consequence" they are attempting to articulate is related to Karma. If the owner of this blog is slandering an innocent person, or an innocent group of people, that person's Karma will catch up to them. I feel this is what was intended but it was not articulated very well.
Secondly, I feel that these comments are much less an attempt to intimidate someone, and much more a cry of help and cry of frustration from young people who have been living under a shadow of suspicion and intolerance in our mainstream Canadian society. Due to the unsubstantiated and sometimes purely fabricated lies of the mainstream media, based solely on hearsay and not on court-case evidence, the Canadian society has started to believe that Sikhs as a community support terrorism. There could be nothing further from the truth. However, because of the unrelenting campaign of the mainstream media, particularly Vancouver Sun's Kim Bolan, and CBC's Terry Milewski, and their superiors, there is an entire generation of young people from Sikh communities in British Columbia, if not Canada, that has had this chip on their shoulders.
Collective responsibility is one thing, but why should these young people assume responsibility for something that might not even have been done by someone from their community? If anyone here has read the book Soft Target, or David Kilgour's accounts of the situation, it is equally possible that the Indian intelligence bombed Air India. That would be consistent with their history of state-sponsored terrorism and the oppression of their own citizens for political gains.
In any case, I feel it is extremely unfair for people like rose (above) to put the words "Sikh" and "immigrant" as synonymous. In fact, some Indian Sikh families have been living in Canada for longer than many European families. There are many generations of Sikhs who were born in Canada, whose parents were born in Canada, and whose grandparents immigrated here. Their "Mother land" is Canada and the problems associated with their culture are Canadian problems.
I feel I've ranted enough - I'll wait for some replies and maybe expand on my opinion if the blog owner allows. Thank you and Happy Canada Day to everyone. May God Bless us all with universal love, truth, and respect for the morals and laws of Canadian society.
Thanks for your post Matt and thanks to everyone else as well, except the trolls;)
To correct you Matt, the trolls were not all "young people" as you indicate and there is no "cultural context" that needs be understood, threats of revenge speak for themselves. As for Karma, facts do not equal slander.
The threats made on the facebook site about Terry M such as,
"if i get a chance.. i will have this white trash choke on his own blood some day..", were obviously judged serious enough that the police felt obliged to investigate.
The Sikh Nationalist content of some of the trolls posts indicates their loyalty so I must also question your contention that this is a "Canadian problem".
While you are certainly correct that Sikhs have a long and well regarded, indeed valued, history as Canadian citizens Rose was also correct in her statement and is not deserving of admonishment.
Futher Matt, I have had the good fortune to correspond with a very well known and respected west coast journalist, someone very well connected and very well regarded within the Sikh community. He has written extensively on Sikh extremism over many years and pulls no punches. I won't reveal his name or bona fides as I did not ask permission. He is horrified to see Muslim youth being recruited in the same fashion as he has witnessed young Sikhs being recruited to the extremist cause. This man is anything but right wing by the way.
The MSM has much to be faulted for, coverage of Sikh extremism isn't one of them. No one here has stated that the Sikh community collectively supports terrorism only that extemists exist within the Sikh Community and judging by the trolls reaction, I for one agree.
Please feel free to add to the discussion at your leisure, you are a welcome contributor.
Matt,
I found your comment here after responding to your point on my site. While I appreciate your tone, all you are offering is the classic "victimizers as victims" defense. It's not these commentators fault, but society's. Even though we read their words as threats, you have an inner guidance that they were not intended that way - and that we should be more tolerant of the poor lad's situation in life. Sorry, but most of us are tired of anonymous internet bullies, and even more tired of efforts to place the blame for bad behavior everywhere except where it belongs - on the individual(s) engaging in such behavior.
Dear Expat Texan:
I know many people like Matt. In their own minds they do mean well but there's way too much Kumbaya and White Guilt marbles rolling around in their heads to realize how deeply manipulated they are.
I was blessed to grow up in Vancouver, BC in the 1960's & 70's, attending a high-school that had a large mixture of kids of Chinese, Indian, Muslim, Jewish origin, not to mention the rest of us!
We just viewed each other as individuals and the very notion that one would be condemned OR EXCUSED for their dreadful actions because of their skin colour or religion simply wasn't in the cards.
What the Matts of the world don't realize is that there are good and bad people of every background. In his world view, bad people only exist amongst White people, generally Christians.
To assert that Kim Bolan and Terry Milewski are "Anti Sikh" is ABSOLUTELY INSANE. To further assert that Milewski's corporate bosses (ie. CBC News Management) are the same gets into the arena of Kafka.
Joseph Stalin often used the term "useful idiots". Matt should read more about it and learn why Uncle Joe would love him.
Hi Everyone,
Please allow me to respond to your responses individually.
Blazing Cat Fur
----
If they were not all young people, or Canadians raised in the shadows of anti-Sikh media bias, then I apologize for the generalization.
Let me clarify, I, like any other sensible Canadian, find personal threats of violence to be completely deplorable and do not condone or defend them individually. However, I feel you are wrong in denying the fact that people have been raised in this country living under a shadow. Everybody has that shadow in some way or another. Native youth can aspire to reach great heights, but it's a pretty big disadvantage being born in a Native reserve to alcoholic parents and traumatized grandparents that studied at residential schools. What I'm trying to say here is many communities, from different cultures, have difficult settings into which they are born and have to struggle in life. I'm not talking about Race, but Cultural context - there are many Europeans who are White but have also suffered through genocide or displacement.
Anyway, leaving that whole issue aside I'll move on to the rest of your post. I think Rose was incorrect because she said "I suggest Sikhs go to the Mother Land." Please read this again. What is the mother land of Sikhs? Well, for Punjabi Sikhs it's Punjab. For Canadian Sikhs it's Canada. Just like there are Buddhists and Hindus and Christians and Muslims from the North Pole to the South, same with Sikhs. They are not an ethnic minority either. There are White Sikhs in Canada too. Sikhs is a term for a faith group and you cannot make the word "Sikh" synonymous with "immigrant" or "refugee."
I'm not sure if the journalist you're mentioning is Salim Jiwa or Gurpreet Singh or Harjinder Thind but there aren't a lot of them and the ones that are out there are only pushing the same agenda as the MSM.
Lastly, I completely disagree with you that the MSM should not be faulted for their coverage of Sikhs. The fact of the matter is these trolls probably all have hair cuts, don't even practice Sikhism, and are more upset that they DON'T have an identity and therefore try to latch onto the Sikh identity because it's the only thing they can identify with after seeing their entire community being bashed by the MSM through constant false propaganda.
Expat Texan
I humbly submit, I am not trying to claim that victimizers are the victims. I do not condone personal threats. However as a student of world cultures, social psychology and human behaviour, I know that these things don't just pop up for no reason. I also get my fair share of internet bullies attacking me, and I do not condone trolls or internet bullies. However, I feel there is a bigger picture.
Pelalusa
You are completely absolutely wrong. I do not have any sense of "White guilt," nor do I feel that there are only bad people amongst Whites or Christians. I recognize that there are bad people in every community and in every background. However, I also recognize that the Indian government has had a lot to gain from defaming the Sikh community in order to kill the Khalistan independence movement. The movement for freedom from oppression by Sikhs in India was a threat to the Congress Party and if you read India's (short) history, you will see that there have been many state-sponsored massacres. They do not mind killing their own to keep the collective under control. I have no doubt that they had a very heavy role in the bombing of Air India 182, and they had nothing to lose and everything to gain from the blame put on the Sikh community, whereby the blame should actually go on the real conspirators - the Indian intelligence.
Lastly, Kim Bolan and Terry Milewski are working people. They have jobs. They need money. They make money by writing. They report. They use previously (socially) established half-truths and full-lies to substantiate their current reporting. Despite the fact that the "facts" they use have never been proven in a court of law, they have journalistic freedom to jump to conclusions about the intentions and attitude of the Sikh community. I am not talking about Kafka. In the same way that the Fox News sometimes bends the truth to meet their slant, and sometimes altogether lies to the American people, Kim Bolan and Terry Milewski get away with a lot that they couldn't were this a Canadian court of law that required evidence and substance.
Thank you all - please feel free to reply.
Matt,
I admire your chutzpah!
Two questions:
1. Do you believe that the attacks on 9/11 were carried out or in some way initiated by the U.S. government or an arm thereof?
2. Do you realize that you have just exposed yourself to libel by Kim Bolan, Terry Milewski, and their employers?
Robert
Pelalusa,
1. I'm not sure. I don't think so. I don't make any absolute assumptions because anything could be the case, but I really don't know about this one. I haven't had the opportunity to follow the investigations of the 9/11 attacks enough to know about these theories.
2. Could you explain how I have done this? I only stated the facts. It has never been proven in a court of law that Sikh extremists, or Sikh fundamentalist, or orthodox Sikhs, or traditional Sikhs, or Sikh nationalists supported, financed or participated in terrorist acts. However, Bolan and Milewski continuously make the false allegation of this and reiterate it in many of their reports. Their reporting has created a perception or a public imagery of Sikhs that is far removed from their reality. I can say this with confidence because I've had many Sikh friends from various backgrounds. Some were traditional, some were moderate, some were capitalist, some socialist, some conformist, some non-conformist, but NONE of them ever saw Bolan or Milewski's reporting as "truthful" or "fact-based."
thanks,
-M.
What you people don't get is that this site always misinterprets people's statements. It's what they do best.
I don't see any threats here.
And I happen to know that at least some of them were women. But again, that's your typical biases coming up as usual.
And look at Pelalusa's comment.
Isn't that a threat?
You people are so hypocritical.
Pelalusa,
Just a followup thought I had.
I strongly believe that the Air India bombing was a plot of the Indian intelligence, due to well-researched reports like the Soft Target book and testimonies of David Kilgour. However, this does not mean I am some type of "conspiracy theory" quack who believes every government is out to get its citizens.
If it was your intention to label me in that category, please be more careful and considerate.
The Indian government is a far more oppressive, corrupt, shameless, and self-absorbed government than any other "democracy." It is not a totalitarian regime like Zimbabwe, or a communist regime like China or Cuba. However, it is an ideological regime that does not shy from killing its own in order to maintain the power of the fundamentalist Brahmin Hindu leadership.
thank you,
-M.
Matt,
It is of no interest to me what you believe or don't believe. But it is very telling.
You're not sure whether George Bush et co. killed approx. 3,000 of their own citizens but you are convinced that the Indian gov't bombed Air India 182.
My earlier question to you about your exposure to a libel suit was clearly not a threat but more a question of "are you sure you want to legally expose yourself to making such libelous accusations?"
If I were the lawyer for the reporters or their employers I would draw the judge's attention to these 2 statements:
"I have no doubt that they had a very heavy role in the bombing of Air India 182."
"[Kim Bolan and Terry Milewski] use previously (socially) established half-truths and full-lies to substantiate their current reporting."
It's my understanding that you, the defendant would then need to prove inconclusively the validity of the first statement. Then you'd need to prove that Bolan and Milewski were deliberately lying.
I very much doubt that you could prove either and then you'd be found guilty in a Canadian Court of Law.
Your only protection is that you're a pseudo-anonymous commenter (though none of us on here are actually anonymous if a lawyer seeks to find out) and not worthy of the cost & time to pursue. But examples have been made of less.
While I vehemently do not agree with your views, my question about libel was strictly out of concern, I assure you.
"But examples have been made of less."
Which begs the question as to whether this site would be made an example of, as one of the worse offenders of libel on the Internet.
Eventually, I am sure...
Thanks M Kaur so glad to piss you off. Keep comin back.
Pelalusa,
Well I think your comparison is very unfair.
I am not completely familiar with the investigation of the 9/11 attack. It may well be that George W. Bush and his administration had some involvement, but I cannot say this with 100% confidence because I have not had a chance to investigate the issue. If you would like to share information with me about the issue, I would love to be enlightened.
I'm not doubting it, I'm just saying I can't confirm it because I don't know and I'm sure you can appreciate that considering your concern for me in the legal sense.
On the topic of the Indian government's involvement, it is a documented fact that:
1) Indian consulate members got refunds for their tickets on Air India flight 182 a few days prior to the flight departure.
2) Some of the "Sikhs" accused of being involvement have been accused by the CSIS itself of having been informants.
3) CSIS destroyed a lot of evidence purposefully, which is said to be the reason for no conviction against Malik and Bagri but in reality it is possible that the evidence would incriminate CSIS more than Malik or Bagri.
4) David Kilgour gives testimony to the story of a Russian spy who was offered incentives to do bombings to defame the Sikh community.
5) Many other points of interest that make it IMPOSSIBLE for there to NOT HAVE BEEN involvement by intelligence agencies, informants, and the Indian government.
RE: Bolan and Milewski - If I give you a list of excerpts from their reports which cite false information as being factual, would that suffice? The list is very long and shows how they intentionally bend the truth because THEY CAN and continues to pay the bills.
Thank you,
Matt
Matt
"It may well be that George W. Bush and his administration had some involvement ...".
People who make statements such as this are probably credulous on a wide variety of opinions. I would be disinclined to accept your other assertions unless you can provide suitable evidence.
Cheers
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